Social Democracy - The only REAL way forward for the left

Originally posted by John Pearce
The words I often hear next are "There has never been Socialism, so how can you judge whether or not it works?" Well, its extremely easy to judge, because its attempted installation in many places around the world, by leaders who (most of the time) want "true" Socialism, always fail to deliver.

Originally posted by Kidfinger
So how do you suppose this 'Social Democracy' would run? How would you hae it set up? Would there be similar Senate and congress? What about presidential powers?

Originally posted by Odium


I think John Pearce has vanished, I can answer how a Socialist Goverment and a Democratic-Socialist Government should be set up if you wish though?

Harmony by Peter "Jayce" Sanford.
The New Style of Government will be a “system”, which is “By the People, for the People”. It will move away from the idea of “Rule from the Top” and allow participation of the Public in the legislative decisions that will have major effect on them and the Nation with elected representatives. Split into two Divisions outlined later on.

This New Government will first have to ratify the below constitution, which will justify equality and protection to all by it majority or minority. Once this is in place they can then begin to pass legislation to uphold these import aspects of Society:

1. We shall not limit freedom of thought, speech, sexual orientation or Religion and the rights that come with these..
   
2. We shell not judge on race, creed, gender, ideology or sexual orientation but actions.
   
3. We shall be respectful of the rights of others and give equality to all regardless.
   
4. We shall be honest, in Government, Industry and any arm of the state.
   
5. We shall be responsible for our actions.
   
6. We shall be fair in all matters to all persons.
   
7. We shall be considerate of the happiness and well being of others.
   
8. We shall have the right to protect ourselves from the Tyranny be it by Government or the Public.
   
9. We shall nurture these values by word & deed in our children, family, friends and acquaintances.
   
10. We shall not limit inquiring or testing by their consequences, on any matter, including this Constitution.

1) Everyone should have the right to say what they think, think what they wish, have adult relationships with those who they deem appropriate and practice what Religion they wish as long as none of these infringe on the Liberties of others or attempt to do harm to another.

2) The Judiciary will be built to represent the Nation, both on Gender, Ethnicity and Social Class. People will be judged on the legal issues, social issues and moral issues of their case. With Council given to both Prosecution and Defence; unless stated otherwise. They will be a “Trial by Pear” unless the case is so complex that it would be hard to understand; such as fraud which will have a special judiciary or one that needs to be kept from the public for reasons of National Security.

3) No law will target one group over another on the fact that they are “different” nor will any “Arm of the State” give special treatment to someone regarding their differences; with the exception of the infirm, mentally ill, physically disabled and children.

4) The Government will be open to both public inquiry and private, the actions which they take should be clear and information they gain should be open to the public - unless in the interests of National Security. All documents older then 5 years, unless being used in a current case will be viewable by the Public and all past Government Crimes will be admitted to.

5) As displayed above, the Government will be responsible for what it does. If the Government knowingly misleads the Public on anything then that Member of the Government will be suspended once there guilt has been proven and they will be accountable in a Court of Law.

6) As outlined above, the Government will run a Policy that does not discriminate against the people in anyway. Acts of discrimination will carry a heavy sentence - with the result of loss of both earnings and liberty. This is the only way to stop the unnecessary bigotry that is evident within modern Society.

7) The Government will work as best it can to provide happiness for the Public, in the form of Social Policy which will attempt to allow them the life they wish to lead. With no infringement on personal life - unless harm is being forced upon an unwilling party. This Social Policy will also best reflect the area that it is representing as not one policy can best server every area of a Nation.

8) The General Public should be able to defend themselves from the Governments of Nations which intend to do them harm and their own Government if it intends to do them harm. A Policy which includes the education of children from an early age about gun control and gun safety should be adopted. Similar to Switzerland and Spain which has some of the lowest homicide rates in the Western World.


9) This Constitution will be outlined and easy to understand as will the legal system; the general public should not need to pay council to have a document translated for them in their native country. Schools should also include classes on educating children about their liberties and of the struggles in which people have had to go through over the past to give us these liberties.

10) The People should have the right to openly debate points of law, both National and Local. This allows for the set up of a Civil Service Group independent of the Government which will allow Town Halls, etc, to be used so these debates can take place and people can voice their opinions. Local Government officials should also attend 2 meetings a month in their area to hear opinions of the public and then bring these back to the Parliament in discussions.

One this constitution has been ratified then the Government will work on implementing radical reforms of their National assembly which will be split into two tiers; the first will have the majority of representatives of the Country and will be elected every 4 years the second will hold 10% as many politicians as the first and run a 4 year term, separated by 2 years from the first.

The two systems will have different areas, allowing for a better representation of the general public for example: in the British Political System there are 646 Constituencies and allowing for 646 members in their first tier of Government, the second tier would allow for 65 members (64.6 rounded up) and each member in the second tier would have a larger constituency then the first tier. This diverse system should allow for laws to be regulated better as both tiers are elected and not hereditary and also give a more diverse representation in the second tier. This is then mirrored down to the Regional Level, but on a smaller scale.

Originally posted by Kidfinger
So how do you suppose this 'Social Democracy' would run? How would you hae it set up? Would there be similar Senate and congress? What about presidential powers?

Originally posted by Frosty
social democracy=cummunism

Originally posted by Odium


No it doesn't.

Go read a book on Communism or Socialism.

Just because you claim something doesn't make it true.

I am also waiting for the evidence that Native Americans are uneducated.

Originally posted by Odium
TrueLies, I'm part Russian.

A lot of my family grew up in the U.S.S.R. but that doesn't stop the fact the systems that are in Government in such places were not Socialist systems.

You yourself even say so here "but you have castro who's living it up, not living by his socialist principles at all".

In turn that stops it from being a Socialist Nation.

You also seem to lack the understanding between Present China, Cuba, the U.S.S.R and what I posted. If you bother to take the time to do some research you would see my view is very critical of these Government just like it is of the "Western" Governments.

Originally posted by John Pearce
It's time to dispell the belief that true, pure, socialism, whether achieved through democratic or revolutionary means, could ever exsist. For a Socialist system to truely exist people would have to be "perfect", they would have to not be greedy, selfish, or self-indulgent. All of these things Socialists and Communists take so much for granted. But as demonstrated through history, the attempted application of a true Socialist system has NEVER, and will NEVER work because humans ARE NOT PERFECT